I am delighted to be able to fire over some questions to Wim de Vries, who has been involved in the Dutch Death Metal scene for many years, who is guitarist and vocalist for the killer old-school Death Metal bands Burial Remains and Grim Fate. I first discovered Burial Remains back in 2019 when their debut album, ‘Trinity Deception’, was released on the label Transcending Obscurity, later to be repressed on the excellent Raw Skull Recordz. Let’s talk about the start of his Metal journey…
First off, I always like to take things back to the beginning. How did you get into Rock and Metal? What’s your earliest memories? And what bands did you discover first on your journey?
I was lucky, my neighbour was listening to rock music and this way I got to hear a lot of guitar-driven music from a young age. But the real damage was done when I was at a friend’s place and his brother was playing some Iron Maiden albums. The first thing he put on was ‘Number of the Beast’ and after that ‘Killers’. The music and the cover art pulled me in right away and my new passion was music. I guess I was 9 years old or something. After that I got in touch with Metallica and Slayer and bands like that, and I was lucky there were always people around me that liked metal as well. It didn’t take long before someone made me a tape with all these new Death Metal bands and I was hooked right away. This must have been around ’89 or something and to this day I listen, collect, play and read about that metal.
Was it love at first listen? Or were you into different genres of music before you discovered metal?
I think most of us start out with metal genres that are closer to mainstream and then start our journey to more extreme genres. After Maiden there was the Thrash Metal, crossover and hardcore, then doom and then there was Death Metal. And when I first heard Death Metal, I became less interested in other genres. But when you get older you start listening again to what you started with and also getting deeper into those genres.
What was your inspiration to take things to the next level and start creating your own music?
Well, I was reading metal magazines, watching MTV’s Headbangers Ball and stuff like that and of course I thought these bands were really cool. But no one around me played an instrument and I never thought I was able to do that. Until the Death Metal scene was over its peak halfway through the ’90s and I got more into hardcore music. That was way easier to play.
Did you start or form a band in your teenage years? And if so what was the band called and what style of music did you play?
It was in my late teenage years that together with some friends we started a metallic Hardcore band. Like the old school Hardcore stuff with some Slayer kinda riffs. The band was called Redefine and we made a demo and did some shows. I was doing vocals, but seriously had no idea what I was doing. When that band stopped I picked up the guitar and even played bass guitar in a band for a while.
Being a guitarist and vocalist, did both come naturally to you? And do you remember the first guitar you had? And if so what was it?
Well I never had any lessons, not because I’m talented, but I get bored easily. It’s more like I wanted to play Death Metal and started playing certain stuff and from there it evolved into something I could work with. While playing I always learned new things or found out I was doing something wrong from the start. Anyway I found myself a way of expressing myself by playing the guitar. My first guitar was some Strat from a cheap starter set, not something very good, but it did the trick. After that lots of guitars came and went.
For vocals it was different. I just couldn’t play any instrument, so that way you can either start to play bass or do vocals. So I began screaming into a mic and learned along the way how to do that without losing your voice. But to be honest, I like playing guitar way more than singing. It’s always a bit annoying when people come up to me like, hey you do vocals in Burial Remains, which makes total sense since that’s what I do on stage, but I started as a guitar player and I still do that on all the albums.
We are roughly the same age, a few months between us. So I’m guessing we grew up being into the same kind of bands? The Netherlands has played a vital role in the Death Metal movement, with bands such as Pestilence, Asphyx, Sinister, Pentacle, Gorefest etc. Were these bands influential in your journey to forming and starting a band?
I think most people of our age grew up listening to the same bands. And we were lucky being there at the peak of the Thrash Metal scene and then Death Metal. Of course I love all these Dutch bands and they had an impact on me, but the Swedish, Finnish, German and American bands were just as important. Especially the Florida bands were really important to me and the impact of the early Morbid Angel albums on me is huge. I’m still spinning those albums almost every week more than 30 years later.
But it’s great that you mention Pentacle, since they might be my favourite Dutch band and they often seem to get overlooked. That band is totally free of trends and always made quality Death Metal, just like how it is supposed to be.
Also we can’t forget the Dynamo Eindhoven festival, which was a huge festival back in the day! The Dutch scene to me, being from London, was always something to look up to!
Dynamo Open Air is a legendary festival and I went there a few times. Hell, as a young Death Metal-minded fool I even decided to skip the Mercyful Fate show there because I couldn’t stand the vocals, which I regret to this day since I really started to love Mercyful Fate later.
But for me personally, living in the northern part of the Netherlands, the Waldrock festival had a way bigger impact on me and they brought all the Death Metal bands almost to my doorstep in the early ’90s. Later on the Stonehenge festival started and that was way more focused on Death Metal and was something I visited almost every year and still do. And you being from London, I can imagine that you look up to anything outside the UK, ha!
You started both of your bands at roughly the same time back in 2017. How did the formation of both of these bands start?
Burial Remains, or Miasma of Guilt as it was called at the beginning, started on Christmas Eve 2016 after a talk between me and my friend Rai of Raw Skull Records. I wanted to do something with an HM2 pedal and he wanted to do vocals. We wrote a bunch of songs and formed the band. It turned out a bit different and we changed the name and got Sven of Fleshcrawl to do vocals. Which was a bit surreal, since Fleshcrawl is one of my favourite bands.
Due to these line-up changes and the music already written I had some time on my hands and started Grim Fate with Pier and we wrote and recorded our first EP in a matter of weeks. I was fairly new to recording and mixing, but during the process I really got interested in that.
Before these bands I was in Boal together with Philippus, who is now in Burial Remains and Grim Fate as well, and that band was hardly doing anything anymore. A year later I had two bands going on. It was a really creative and productive period of time.
Did you get the opportunity to play many gigs with both bands? And what gigs stand out for you?
Grim Fate never played live, although at some point we were supposed to do a tour with Funebrarum, but that fell through unfortunately for the reason that our live line-up had one guy too many to fit in the touring van. After that we never put much effort into playing live because we wanted to focus on Burial Remains.
When we started playing live with Burial Remains we got a lot of offers and had great shows and festivals lined up, but after only a few shows the whole Covid crap happened. That was a great setback, since you lose momentum so to say. After that we started playing again and we did almost all the more extreme festivals in the Netherlands and also really great gigs and festivals throughout Europe.
Some stood out, like Schoonebeek Deathfest, which was the first gig after Covid as well as a memorial to the passing of Sven. That was a special gig in many ways. Besides that I loved the smaller gigs a lot, where the crowd is totally in your face and when they go nuts you really feel their energy. Our gig at the Bambi in Hamburg on our weekend tour with Phrenelith and Demored was really special, as well as Symbolic Fest in the Czech Republic. Coming there for the first time and the whole crowd seems to know about your band and goes totally crazy during our gig, that to me is what Death Metal is about.
What bands, if any, influenced Burial Remains and Grim Fate? For me personally I love hearing the old school Swedish bands especially in Burial Remains, which for me is one of my favourite bands in the last 10 years easily!
Of course we are influenced by other bands although we don’t try to copy them. We are not the most original band out there and that is a good thing, since when bands are described as having a really original sound, most of the time it means I hate the music.
Of course there is the Swedish influence and in particular Dismember is something that always impressed us. But also bands like Autopsy, Bolt Thrower and a lot of Thrash Metal influenced us. We are always linked to the Swedish sound because of the HM2 pedal, but when you listen to the riffs, you will see that the influence of bands like early Kreator is really incorporated in our riffs.
For Grim Fate we are way more influenced by bands like Incantation and the old Finnish scene. I always liked the gloomy sound of bands like Rippikoulu, early Amorphis, Demigod and Sentenced among others. It’s more a blend of dark Death Metal and Doom I guess. On our later releases we went really slow, but for the newer stuff we speed things up again.
You’ve always included a cover song on each of your studio albums like Fleshcrawl, Slaughter and Infernal Majesty. Are these bands personal favourites of yours?
You even forgot the Kreator cover on our debut album! All these bands mean something special to me. Fleshcrawl of course was a tribute to Sven. The other bands are all extreme Thrash Metal/Death Metal bands from the ’80s and had a big impact on my musical taste.
I really like to play these songs and by putting them as a bonus on our albums I kinda hope we introduce these bands to younger people listening to our music and that they go look for those bands. This is how I found out about a lot of bands when I was young. We also used to play ‘Evil Death’ by Death at some of our live shows. We already have some ideas for other cover songs on future releases.
Let’s talk about the latest Burial Remains album. On ‘Adversarial’, destruction doesn’t seem to function solely as an external conflict, but also as an inner, ideological purge. To what extent is being “adversarial” a stance toward the world, and to what extent is it a stance toward oneself
Interesting question. Most of the songs deal with luciferian and occult themes and some are just plain anti-religious. So one could say the songs deal about external conflicts as you name it. But at the same time some songs or parts may deal way more with the way we think about life or about our occult visions. I don’t want to go to much into the songs, since it’s for the listener to decide what they get out of it. We’re not preachers and don’t want to convince anyone of our views. We really don’t care. The inside struggle is more the way you think and what is accepted in this world. I don’t want to be limited by rules or expectations of others, but this leads confrontations. But I wouldn’t call this an inner conflict really. If you are true to yourself this is just the bullshit that comes on your path and that you have to deal with. In the end this world sucks and needs to be destroyed sooner than later.
Musically, Adversarial brings the Thrash influence more prominently to the surface within its old school Death Metal foundation. Was that a deliberate aesthetic choice to intensify the sense of conflict, or did it emerge organically from the album’s themes?
Well, I think the Thrash influence was there from the beginning, but this time it just came out more to the surface due to the song structures. And it’s never really a choice, since when Phil and I write songs it’s really a spontaneous jam from where we try and find the parts we want to use. And we are always looking for intense riffs. When you start playing and you really feel the riff and want to bang your head you know you’re on to something. And when you have a bunch of riffs its all about arranging it and get some dynamics. On this album its just came more Thrashy than before, but when you listen to the older albums you will notice that it was always there.
I was very fortunate to witness your last ever live show with Burial Remains at Stonehenge Festival in 2025, and what a great gig it was! What was your decision to stop playing live shows? And can you ever see you guys coming out of retirement? What are your thoughts on that last performance?
Thank you! Stonehenge was a lot of fun, especially since I’ve been visiting this festival myself since the early days. It was a great place to do our last live show. It’s not that we are done, but health reasons mean that playing live is no option anymore. Of course we could have done some line-up changes, but that will never be Burial Remains.
We said right away that this is our last show and we are not coming back. Bands like Kiss are already on their 18th farewell tour. Not to compare ourselves with that shitty band of course, but we made our decision and it’s definite.
It was a good gig and I think it was our biggest gig and everyone seemed to have a good time, on and off stage, which is perfect. We really enjoyed it and a lot of people told us that it was too bad we quit playing live. I think it’s better this way than that the health issues make future shows not that good and people are happy we finally quit. We wished we could have been going on for quite some years, but it’s good as is.
Will you still be releasing new material in the future? Or is that it?
Hell yeah, in fact we finished recordings for a split album already and we are waiting for the other band to finish their part. A few great songs and another raging cover song are being served to you sometime soon. Besides that some songs for the next full-length are already written, but that will take a bit longer. But we are not done yet as a band!
Are you involved in any new upcoming projects? If you are, are you able to give any details?
Hell, I need to learn to say no. I think I have three projects or bands in the works. It is a lot, but why not do it. When you have some friends that want to do a band or project, it’s best to have fun and make some new music.
I don’t want to talk about most projects yet because they are far from a release, but we have this international band/project called Skullchurn which is more like ’80s Death Metal. We are in the finishing stages of a demo and that will be released soon through Into It Records. I already have new stuff for that band written, so that is probably going to be something really active for the years to come. I’m really excited about how the songs turned out and can’t wait to put it out.
Ok so we’re nearing the end now. I know you’re involved with a local festival that you put on every year, Drachten Deathfest, and this year’s line-up was amazing! Is this something that you will be spending more time with in the future; gig promotion? And if so is there any bands in particular you’d like to book?
I already do Drachten Deathfest on and off since 2002, but in the last couple of years I teamed up with my friend Dirk and we are way more consistent in its appearance. It’s way harder these days to find the right bands that are interesting enough to draw a big crowd and still be underground enough. But we managed to have a great line-up this year again and we are already working on next year’s edition.
I won’t be spending more time on it, since it’s only once a year and that’s just enough to keep it fun and interesting. If you do it more often it might become something of a job. There’s always some crap happening in organising a festival and when you do it once a year you soon forget the annoying stuff, but doing this regularly I don’t think it would be as much fun.
What is your take on the current music scene in the Netherlands? And in general?
I guess it’s the same as always, there are good things and bad things. Good bands, bad bands, nice bands, arrogant bands. New times, same bullshit.
When I look at our local scene the good thing is that it is really active and there are a lot of young people at shows. And they keep coming. For the future of Death Metal that is really important. Even though I don’t like the more modern bands like Frozen Soul or Sanguisugabogg, it’s important not to be a gatekeeper. It’s their entrance into the music and without the youngsters this scene would be slowly dying.
Also great is that we have this young promoter Erik of Black Horizons doing all these underground shows in the northern part of the Netherlands. This younger generation is really picking up the glove and I really love it.
It seems the younger generation are not so keen on buying physical albums these days, with the likes of Spotify and other streaming platforms being the way for the new generation. I know from several bands I have spoken to, they hate the online streaming platforms, especially as they pay the artists fucking nothing! Do you think there will still be a demand for physical copies of records in the future?
To me personally it’s about physical albums and playing those from the first to the last song. When I look at my own kids, they have playlists with all kinds of songs and trends seem to be gone faster than they appear. To me this doesn’t work.
Recently we got all our music off streaming services for the simple reason that it doesn’t fit the way we look at music. It’s all about the algorithm and stuff that we don’t know shit about and in fact don’t want to know anything about. It was funny to see reactions ranging from people saying it was a good decision to some people saying we are done now. Each opinion comes from one’s own perspective of course and to be honest I don’t care.
Of course we will not reach a certain crowd, but when they only listen on streaming services they were never our crowd to begin with. The whole payment thing is something else. When you pay 15 euros a month for your Spotify subscription while one CD is already 15 euros and vinyl even more, then you can imagine that bands will get paid shit. With the whole Napster thing it was called theft, but this Spotify crap is also theft. The money goes to the biggest artists and to the streaming company. As an underground scene we should get our music off altogether and buy physical media, that way it’s kind of affordable to run a band. Even then you won’t make much money, if any at all, but with this streaming bullshit you are funding a company who doesn’t give a shit about a band, or a scene or a crowd. It’s only about money.
I’d like to say a massive thank you, Wim, for taking part in this interview for VM Underground. Is there anything else you would like to add?
Thank you Dylan for the interview! I hope people keep an eye out for our future releases and please buy physical copies of albums you like and go to shows!
